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Post by Morgana on Jun 21, 2022 7:39:21 GMT -6
I re-watched that documentary 4 times over the weekend for that reason and the interviews. There are nuggets throughout it as you have stated.
Just to clarify...I had time. I watched it 2x in it's entirety and twice going through for specifics.
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Post by marionumber1 on Jun 21, 2022 10:38:10 GMT -6
For Marionumber1 What does it mean when you or others speculate that the Process was CIA/MI6 front? I think that many of the most mainstream satanic groups were created by Western intelligence. The Church of Satan was started by Anton LaVey, who has been linked to Israeli gun running (per Blanche Barton's officially-sanctioned biography) and Interpol (per a source who spoke to author Jim Keith), and whose church had an inordinate number of police, military, and intelligence officers as members. One such member, of course, was Army intelligence officer Michael Aquino, who later broke away to start the Temple of Set; and his top lieutenants during the 80s were (per a SFPD intelligence report) military intelligence officers as well. The modern-day Satanic Temple is run by Douglas Mesner aka Lucien Greaves, who allegedly told his former partner Shane Bugbee that "the C.I.A. had asked him to write some private reports for them". As for the Process Church itself, it was incorporated by Tommy Baumler, a New Orleans lawyer who worked for Guy Banister's "private detective agency" to infiltrate student groups. Banister's firm was a thinly-veiled CIA front, connected to various anti-Castro operations; it also employed Lee Harvey Oswald, as attested to by multiple witnesses who worked for Banister and the fact that Oswald's Fair Play for Cuba Committee fliers were stamped with Banister's agency's address. So the ever-present CIA connection is in the background of the Process as well. As for MI6, I base that suspicion on the Process's British origins, the fact that the CIA and MI6 have often been close partners, and the reported involvement of Mary Ann MacLean in the Profumo affair which appears to have been a sexual blackmail scheme by British intelligence. Former Process member Timothy Wyllie, who wrote a supposed expose of the church that is likely disinformational, actually had a mother who worked for MI6. I'm referring to the more lurid side of TUE that focuses on the satanic/occult nature of the crimes. While that likely was how the lower-level footsoldiers viewed it, I'm inclined to believe that the Son of Sam murders ultimately had more "mundane" motives: a mixture of murder-for-hire and Operation Gladio-style strategy-of-tension. The satanism appears to be a way of drawing in societal lowlifes/burnouts (promising them power that's otherwise lacking from their lives), binding the group together (through shared ritual practices), and lowering their inhibitions for acts of extreme violence. But what the group is really doing, beneath that veneer, is the full gamut of organized crime activities: arms dealing, drug smuggling, human trafficking (of adults and children), child pornography, and murder-for-hire. And I am not totally sure whether Berkowitz was as low-level as he often presents himself. He still refuses to give information on Son of Sam to this day, preferring to jerk around or simply ignore those who correspond with him. Aside from one assassination attempt early on, he's apparently been safe in prison even as the other "Disciples of Hell" dropped like flies; I feel like if he was that much of a risk and had no real juice protecting him, there would have been more attempts on his life. He has provocative associations with the Army, including allegedly being a subject of LSD experimentation there, and the IBI security firm that make me wonder if he could have been a more direct functionary of the cult's likely intelligence backers.
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Post by Admin Horan on Jun 21, 2022 11:08:42 GMT -6
In TUE 2021, Maury says that the book was spirited (get it?) out of the prison, and then mailed to Gardner from a "zip code we traced to a particular post office in lower Manhattan" (the location of the Magickal Childe was surrounded by a ring of post offices.)
PS Y'all know Ed Butler ("Did Hate Kill Tate?") once interviewed Lee Harvey in N.O., right?
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Post by marionumber1 on Jun 21, 2022 11:33:00 GMT -6
Another interesting Manson connection to the CIA milieu in New Orleans: "Family" member Bruce Davis was treated during childhood (around 1952) for a carotid aneurysm at the Ochsner Clinic in New Orleans. Go to this link and play the video starting at 25:55 to hear Davis speaking about it. The Ochsner Clinic was started by Alton Ochsner, a wealthy New Orleans businessman who co-founded and financially supported the Information Council of the Americas (INCA) of which Ed Butler was executive director. Ochsner was friends with Clay Shaw, and in fact feared being indicted in Jim Garrison's investigation. He was very likely part of MKUltra, through his involvement with Tulane University's medical school (identified as a site of experimentation by MK victims like Claudia Mullen) and the East Louisiana State Hospital (where Oswald had once applied for a job and where LSD "treatments" went on). That might raise some questions about what kind of treatment Davis received from the Ochsner Clinic...
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Jon
Junior Member
Posts: 72
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Post by Jon on Jun 21, 2022 12:09:16 GMT -6
"Vinny" existed. I can't be more specific than that, unfortunately, but Maury didn't invent him. Some of those prison informant letters are visible in Sons of Sam. In fact, there are several things visible in Josh Zeman’s documentary that either nobody notices or they don’t want to talk about. That's right. My assurances alone will mean little to the people who approach Maury's theory skeptically, but I can say that on the basis of my own research, his conclusions were accurate. There are very specific reasons that he implicated the Process Church (and I absolutely believe that the Process was operating on behalf of British intelligence), but the story goes much further back in Yonkers. There was a group of societal elites who enjoyed abusing children, and there were rituals; as Maury said, this had been going on at least since the early 1950s, though there are indications that this activity preceded the arrival of the infamous "British doctor" (whom I believe to have been a composite of several individuals, including locals as well as Brits).
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Post by Morgana on Jun 21, 2022 12:18:15 GMT -6
For marionumber1 regarding the Process and Intelligence. I am of the same school of thought and have discovered over and over what you have stated. One thing I keep in mind IS most if not all "powers that be" are practitioners of the Occult. Sure you have lower levels for various reasons. And many other types of practices. I don't believe the rituals I've read about and learned of in Untermyer Park and a few close by locations were micky mouse kids. Not saying they are of elite status. They knew what they were doing and I personally don't under estimate them in their practice. They weren't dabblers. Does that have anything to do with SOS. No idea. Intelligence can use the occult as a front. But I believe through study and investigation...they too are and can be practitioners. Thanks for all you have been sharing Mario.
PS. Jon I believe the Process was connect to this somehow.
Untermyer Park/Gardens was designed and built by Untermyer for his devotion and practice as an Occultist. We know this. I will gather it's always been used by people throughout the years for that.
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Post by barney on Jun 21, 2022 17:52:24 GMT -6
Another interesting Manson connection to the CIA milieu in New Orleans: "Family" member Bruce Davis was treated during childhood (around 1952) for a carotid aneurysm at the Ochsner Clinic in New Orleans. Go to this link and play the video starting at 25:55 to hear Davis speaking about it. The Ochsner Clinic was started by Alton Ochsner, a wealthy New Orleans businessman who co-founded and financially supported the Information Council of the Americas (INCA) of which Ed Butler was executive director. Ochsner was friends with Clay Shaw, and in fact feared being indicted in Jim Garrison's investigation. He was very likely part of MKUltra, through his involvement with Tulane University's medical school (identified as a site of experimentation by MK victims like Claudia Mullen) and the East Louisiana State Hospital (where Oswald had once applied for a job and where LSD "treatments" went on). That might raise some questions about what kind of treatment Davis received from the Ochsner Clinic... Great info, thanks. Did you know William Blatty (did I get the name right) of the book/movie The Exorcist married a much younger female tennis player named Turo ( I have no idea if this is the correct spelling) and Turo's mother was hailed as the first baby (1921) delivered by Doctor Ochsner. Turo's father was a commercial pilot that worked with David Ferrie. There are links of the Process and RFK's murder as well.
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Post by Admin Horan on Jun 21, 2022 21:59:11 GMT -6
Nopey. I did not know that.
I've said it before, and I'll say it again: Jebus!
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Post by barney on Jun 22, 2022 14:19:18 GMT -6
Another interesting Manson connection to the CIA milieu in New Orleans: "Family" member Bruce Davis was treated during childhood (around 1952) for a carotid aneurysm at the Ochsner Clinic in New Orleans. Go to this link and play the video starting at 25:55 to hear Davis speaking about it. The Ochsner Clinic was started by Alton Ochsner, a wealthy New Orleans businessman who co-founded and financially supported the Information Council of the Americas (INCA) of which Ed Butler was executive director. Ochsner was friends with Clay Shaw, and in fact feared being indicted in Jim Garrison's investigation. He was very likely part of MKUltra, through his involvement with Tulane University's medical school (identified as a site of experimentation by MK victims like Claudia Mullen) and the East Louisiana State Hospital (where Oswald had once applied for a job and where LSD "treatments" went on). That might raise some questions about what kind of treatment Davis received from the Ochsner Clinic... One other factoid about Bruce Davis he married the fiance of President Gerald Ford's son Stephen Ford. Manson family member Squeeky Fromme tried to kill President Gerald Ford in 1975.
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Post by Admin Horan on Jun 22, 2022 20:35:46 GMT -6
Are you kidding me?
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Post by barney on Jun 22, 2022 23:22:27 GMT -6
carwreckdebangs.wordpress.com/tag/bruce-davis/Quote: Squeaky Fromme had tried to shoot President Gerald Ford in 1975, famously proclaiming “Can you believe it? It didn’t go off!”. Why she did it wasn’t really clear. Something far weirder is the tale of Bruce Davis while he was in prison. In 1984, he met Beth Wilson through his born again Christian work, and they became very taken with each other. So taken, that Beth broke up with her fiance, Steven Ford, son of former President Gerald Ford. She broke up with Ford, and married Davis in 1985. How Gerald Ford shows up twice in a Manson Family tale is beyond me.
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Post by tomdex on Jun 22, 2022 23:34:15 GMT -6
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Post by barney on Jun 22, 2022 23:45:00 GMT -6
Shirley Tuero, mother in law to William Blatty of the movie The Exorcist.
SHIRLEY TUERO OBITUARY Shirley Swedlund Tuero passed on August 15, 2014 at the age of 92. She was the wife of the late William Oscar Tuero, a captain with Delta Airlines. Born in Chicago of parents Florence Hallstrom Swedlund and Helmer Swedlund on September 13, 1921, she was the very first baby delivered by an unknown intern by the name of Dr. Alton Ochsner. In the 1940s she was a ticket agent for Chicago & Southern Airlines and met a young Memphis pilot named William Tuero; they married August 31, 1946 and eventually moved to New Orleans. A longtime member of Munholland Methodist Church, Shirley was a generous and philanthropic Christian woman. She always loved her Sunday School group as well as interacting with the children on Sundays. A cancer survivor, Shirley volunteered for over 39 years at Ochsner Hospital, and in recognition of her work was named by City Business as a Health Care Hero, and awarded the President's Volunteer Service Award by the President's Council on Service and Civic Participation. She was also a longtime member of the New Orleans Country Club. Known to all her family as "Noni," her laugh, quick wit and sharp tongue will be sorely missed. She is survived by her daughters Linda Tuero Lindsley (husband Dr. William Lindsley) and Jennifer Tuero Melius (husband Dr. Brian Melius), her grandchildren William Peter Blatty Jr., Jennifer Tuero Blatty, Kristen Adamson Gallagher (husband Ryan Gallagher), David William Paul, Grant Melius Worrell (husband Ryan Worrell) and Logan Eloise Melius, and her great-grandchildren Gabriel Tuero Blatty and Liam Daniel Gallagher.
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Post by Omega on Jun 23, 2022 7:46:54 GMT -6
HOLY SH*T!!
Looks to be a GOLDMINE!
The audio quality seems to be a little better on the archive.org link Morgana posted.
Interesting cast of interviewees - from victims to eyewitnesses to North Dakota to Berkowitz personal connections, etc.!
THANKS Tomdex/Morgana for posting these and the heads up!
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Post by Morgana on Jun 23, 2022 9:14:49 GMT -6
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