louie
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Post by louie on Oct 6, 2022 15:29:17 GMT -6
Ok, so I think I've read every post here re: keddie...
My most burning questions are;
1.) Dana literally had his ass whupped w/ a broom handle. What are all the explanations for that? I can see the mainstream media believes two horror movie villains showed up and tortured everyone (but the three boys,) with creepy glasses and smiles; then there's the Marde/Bo angle and the one out forth here, that he was wearing a wire and it hit the fan. To me, this is a crucial detail, but maybe I don't know enough about the case.
2.) The holes in the wall made by knives. I don't see much about that. Mainstream is that the psychos were pinning the boys to the wall, or something to that effect. I can't figure out why Marde/Bo would do that. And its only really something I can see Phil Shearer doing as he held the scissors. (Shearer/Scissors- who writes this stuff?) Maybe they were there before? This seems like the rabbit hole.
3.) The flute case. That was Sheila's. She loved that flute and wrote about it in a poem featuring Satan. I don't know man. I feel this is another big little detail. Whats with the grisly tableaux featuring hammer and knife and flute case and weird shirt? Coupled w/ the handle-with-care attitude re: the flute case? Was the flute found? Was the bag flipped and emptied and then someone picked the flute case up?
4.) The camels weren't Sue's? There were two packs, one one the couch, where the missing cushion Dana's head was rested on and another crumpled up pack on a book case? What is up with that?
5.) Not to get all wackadoo, but Sue's real name is Glenna. I mean come on. These people are so weird, so comfy w/ child drug dealers, sex with minors and outright pedophiles/convicted child rapists that I can envision a cult situation (Plumas is no stranger to that) Was Don from MA? Jackie in Medford? The Meeks come across like hillbilly DuPonts (some of whom lived in Keddie) What did Jim Sharp do? Edit: obvs Glenna Meeks is the other Glenna and was Sue's 'best friend'. Is that more believable or understandable than I think it is? Given what happened and the high weird of how it did or didnt happen, it just seems really compelling. I mean all these kids are murder suspects, ffs. Why were the Seaforts so judgemental re: Sue?
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louie
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Post by louie on Oct 6, 2022 16:50:13 GMT -6
just read we're not supposed to make threads. sorry about that, please delete or move.
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Post by kmik on Oct 6, 2022 22:09:48 GMT -6
Just a lot of questions that will probably never be answered.
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louie
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Post by louie on Oct 7, 2022 3:21:11 GMT -6
Hi. Thanks for replying. I figured as much.
Don Davis seems like the central figure to me. He's obsessed w/ getting Sheila away, to the Meeks, to Medford. In his interview he stated he couldn't identify the bodies, which sounds bogus. Like he's just obsessed w/ saying 'Tina is missing, Tina is missing'. Also, wasn't he there before the police. I've not gone over the case enough to have solid, embedded reference points to disassemble this version, but we know he's lying. So, to speculate (sorry,) the boys are killed, Sue ends up dead, and theres a staggering amount of 'hebephiles' (were they just women to these people?) drooling in the background. Don Davis, Glenna Meeks in Quincy; The Keddie Crew w/ Glenna Sharp the outcast? Doug Thomas, works for the HA & Reno mob [?] Gamberg, the disgraced cop. Stoy and Hagwood seem compromised, the others seem legit. Theres a Don Davis in Quincy, related to the Bodenhams. Is that the same guy? This case reminds me of the Yuba County Five, right down the road, where everything is not so much lost to the elements, and the hills, but the assorted cast of characters. I guess they're all like that idk
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Post by snoho17 on Oct 9, 2022 4:01:58 GMT -6
"He's obsessed w/ getting Sheila away, to the Meeks, to Medford." I'd never heard that before. From all accounts I've seen, Sue wasn't an outcast, but really only got close to a few. No one could ID the bodies until they had been taken and cleaned up due to their condition on discovery. It was Justin who supposedly said Tina was missing. The calls to police and Don came within moments of each other, as far as I know officer Klement arrived before Don, but I'd have to go check. "3.) The flute case. That was Sheila's. She loved that flute and wrote about it in a poem featuring Satan." I recall her not "featuring" Satan, but fearing him. " I mean come on. These people are so weird, so comfy w/ child drug dealers, sex with minors and outright pedophiles/convicted child rapists" That's one hell of a blanket statement to make on an entire community. Maybe we showcase the bad because we're looking for people capable of monstrosity, but most of us have it hidden in our own home towns, we've just unfortunately shined a light onto this one.
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louie
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Post by louie on Oct 9, 2022 20:09:30 GMT -6
"He's obsessed w/ getting Sheila away, to the Meeks, to Medford." I'd never heard that before. From all accounts I've seen, Sue wasn't an outcast, but really only got close to a few. No one could ID the bodies until they had been taken and cleaned up due to their condition on discovery. It was Justin who supposedly said Tina was missing. The calls to police and Don came within moments of each other, as far as I know officer Klement arrived before Don, but I'd have to go check. "3.) The flute case. That was Sheila's. She loved that flute and wrote about it in a poem featuring Satan." I recall her not "featuring" Satan, but fearing him. " I mean come on. These people are so weird, so comfy w/ child drug dealers, sex with minors and outright pedophiles/convicted child rapists" That's one hell of a blanket statement to make on an entire community. Maybe we showcase the bad because we're looking for people capable of monstrosity, but most of us have it hidden in our own home towns, we've just unfortunately shined a light onto this one. Thank you for correcting me. I looked back at her poem and I got some things jumbled. I had read or heard that Don Davis was there before anyone. Humanity is rife w/ crime and depravity. I'm a drunk monkey myself, but Keddie seems to be what I'd call a hotspot. A designated batting cage. For example, in Delaware, there was an area known as Dobbinsville that matches this place exactly. In Northern Manhattan, it gets narrowed down to streets and buildings... In DE we also have/had an area known as Arden that is like Keddie but upper middle class. Was just being a lazy non-specific jerkass blerger, apologies to those from there. I was speaking about Don Davis in an interview I saw in the doc. Not him at the crime scene. Re: Tina is missing
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louie
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Post by louie on Oct 9, 2022 21:35:23 GMT -6
Just have to add here that that whole 'cant tell Tina from Sue' is suspect af also, I'm struggling to articulate when I say Sue was outcast.. I've come to adore her as she was; but she was a mother of hells angels, not the biker gang, ofc, but her own. she seems an afterthought in this case. don't know why that is. more of a no-go. I have 404'd sheila's poem but it said so much, can't find it. Really believe her and Don Davis are the keys. Don is still alive, it seems? Justin is a noid
Just wanted to add, sorry if I'm an insensitive dork. Just struck me I get into this stuff around August, which is when Halloween begins for me. nothing worse than some jackass treating someone's life & death like a spoopy occasion
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Post by kmik on Oct 10, 2022 17:26:25 GMT -6
Sheila calling Don seems to me like the right thing to do - that was her only adult family member close by and Sue was not a big woman and she was gagged so I’m sure it wasn’t easy to identify her and LE wanted to confirm it was Sue before releasing to the public who exactly was missing.
I’d like to think Don would be key to what was going on with the family but if Sue didn’t confide in him a lot then he could only go by what he’d seen and heard?
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Post by snoho17 on Oct 11, 2022 2:47:30 GMT -6
Adrenaline at 100%,chaos and confusion. I have never been in a situation quite like that, but I can tell you there's a need to do Something, to reach out to Someone, Anyone, Everyone. There's no sitting still with your arms crossed and waiting. 15 mins turn into 3hrs when your waiting on emergency crews to arrive. I'd bet Zonita Seabolt was the one with a presence of mind to call 911, and then Sheila probably called every phone # she new starting with Uncle Don, that'd be my first call. And if those calls were made within minutes of each other, it is possible Don got their first. LE and emergency responders need to access and grab gear, where Don may have been in his car before the phone hit the cradle.
'cant tell Tina from Sue' Again, alot of damage was done. Sue was barely over 5' and weighed around 100lbs. I think Tina was just under 5' and weighed 80-90lbs? "Sue was an outcast" I can't speak for Keddie or Plumas, but it's not so much outsiders that are hated but growth/expansion/change. I'd think Sue and her brood would have gotten on fine, struggling like many, minding their own business. In a place like that there's freedom to mind your own business while being part of a small, tight community. It attracts the Idyllic, the Loners, and some no gooders.
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louie
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Post by louie on Oct 13, 2022 10:42:30 GMT -6
I've seen guys burned up or blown up by IED's and been able to ID them. I saw some Afghanis-- just really blasphemed by some bandits- probably worse than Keddie, and way afterwards, and I could ID them just after patrolling the village a few times. One of them was 38 and her daughter was 22. I could tell the age difference. I was not a pro in that area, I was just there observing. That's all anecdotal but just where I'm coming from.. I just can't buy his story. One can use grief as an excuse, but that's not my experience w/ people grieving. They get down to business, if they're sincere. Theres a a sort of 'dissociative' state where reality is accepted and the intimate goes away. I'm certain Don and Sheila were lying.. Why? It might never be known.. I'm actually drawing a blank but I believe Prof Horan outlined their dishonesty perfectly. I'm going off DMac as well, total wang chung But I think that's the central question, their morning lies? IDK.. I might be way off. I binged this case and that's no substitute for years of study
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Post by kmik on Oct 13, 2022 19:44:30 GMT -6
Well I’m no professional in any area but have also studied what reports are available to the public and I do feel like a lot of things were held back that might have helped the case but I also think we might form a different opinion on that if we were able to read all of the case files.
From what I have seen it appears Don held little back in discussing what was going on with the family as far as what he himself knew or had heard.
I absolutely understand that it was difficult to positively confirm that it was Sue instead of Tina due to what was done to her. There was no need to have LE or the public looking for the wrong person. From what Don has said he told them he thought it was Sue as they carried her away from 28 and was later called to the mortuary to look again to be sure - and I’m gonna guess he was called there because it would offer him a more calm setting.
I certainly don’t think Don had any reason to kill his sister/family nor Sheila her mother/family but that’s not to say they didn’t have their own opinion of who might have.
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Post by hope on Oct 14, 2022 10:30:21 GMT -6
Welcome Louie, so glad you joined us : ) I also don't believe anyone would have mistaken Sue for Tina. Maybe initially before anyone knew who the victims were? I think about something Zonita said in a documentary outtake + Marty said the same thing in his interview. They mention how they thought it was possibly Dana who committed the murders. Then they learned he was a victim. Somewhere (documentary or old forum?) Marilyn even mentioned people were questioning if Sue had killed the kids and left. It sounds like the neighbors & family were outside speculating on possible scenarios.
I feel like somewhere between that morning and when the documentary was made things became blurred. Speculative discussions got mixed into what happened during the investigation? If that makes sense? I'm not doing a very good job putting my thoughts into words. I wonder if something similar happened with Don's memory of ID'ing Tina? If he identified them at the scene and then was asked to identify again at Anderson's, perhaps it was the protocol. Not understanding why he was asked twice it got turned into having to ID twice because they weren't sure if it was Sue or Tina?
Justin was supposedly saying Tina was missing - No way it took hours before LE even noticed she was missing. That's been blurred into a fact of the case as well.
I'm pretty sure Don did arrive before LE. It's hard because Klement's reports are allegedly missing. They probably contain a wealth of information being the first officer on scene. Shame we can't read them. But other reports have officers asking Jamie, Don and Les H if they went into the cabin prior to LEs arrival. LE are also criticized for allowing people into the crime scene, but they couldn't control what happened before they arrived.
It is very strange the flute case is sitting on that table with the other items that are obviously posed. Could if have been used in the crime somehow? You're right, Keddie does appear to be a hotspot of sorts. Unfortunately the victims are the ones under the microscope when it seems the majority of people living there had some sort of skeleton in their closet.
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Post by hope on Oct 14, 2022 10:40:29 GMT -6
Oh yeah, you're correct the Camels were not Sue's. She smoked the Benson & Hedges. It was speculated for years the killers left those camels. But a report stated Dana smoked Camel's and Johnny smoked Marlboros. The empty pack on the bookshelf behind the door is odd. Maybe the boys were sharing that night (no Marlboros found & Mr. Dorris had given Dana $5 to get burgers with Johnny). Their one pack was almost empty and they bought a new pack with the $5?? You'd think if the killers smoked they would have taken that practically full pack. Maybe not though.
If I remember correctly LE documented what cigarette butts were in the ashtray in Sue's room but not the living room. Was it empty? Neither J or D had the opportunity to smoke a cigarette while there. But the pack is left on the couch, spot where the cushion was removed. As someone just arriving home might do, out the pocket toss onto the couch? Or was someone searching the boys and they tossed the cigs onto the couch? So many questions
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Post by snoho17 on Oct 14, 2022 23:42:49 GMT -6
Thanks for clearing those things up Hope! One thought I'd had, maybe the killer(s) were in the process of wiping the weapons down, Maybe that's why there was blood on the shirt, maybe it's at this point Tina comes out and now there's this whole other problem they gotta deal with.
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