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Post by abraxas82 on May 24, 2021 21:57:23 GMT -6
I'm looking for the official homicide reports. Especially the Stacy Moskowitz one.
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Post by Admin Horan on May 25, 2021 8:35:50 GMT -6
Somebody has some GSK files?  ? Do you know which police department? Supposedly, "Son of Sam" and Berko in particular was "scheduled" to strike in New Jersey. THAT would have brought in the FBI, and luckily for New York (not to mention New Jersey,) that never happened. Berkowitz was suddenly arrested. We ONLY have files in "Zodiac" because California DOJ's Mel Nicolai had asked every department to send him copies of all their pertinent files so he could make more copies to distribute among interested parties at the SF "Zodiac" conference in October, 1969. The FBI filed away their copies, and Mike Rodelli found out about that and obtained [most of] them in 1998. Several years ago, Mike Morford received what the FBI claimed was the last, unreleased files (mostly touching on Gareth Penn) they had. That dump included the very incriminating files on the investigation into park ranger Dennis Land, who had committed suicide, obviating any "privacy" concerns. Morf shared all those pages (except for one, but I got that, anyway.) Where was I? Oh, yeah. Tom Voigt, who used to have his nose up Graysmith's ass, until he double-crossed Graysmith, made a "deal" with Rodelli, then double-crossed Rodelli. Then, he made a deal with Michael Butterfield, and they double-crossed each other. Each one tried to hold back certain files, but between them, they released them all. Jake Wark once had access to VPD's files, but he didn't work there very long. It is obvious that VPD WITHHELD three crucial reports from the collection they sent to Nicolai--the report of the interviews of Darlene Ferrin's family the night of the shooting; sheriff deputy Ben Villareal's promised "full report" of just what the hell he and Hoffman were doing at BRS park at the precise moment of the shooting; and the report from California CII on the ballistics check of the P38 that BEN VILLAREAL took off Donald Warren Benson July 20, 1969. No one has ever seen those three reports, and VPD will NOT even discuss the matter. I'm still working on California CII. So, who knows? But the funny thing is, CII would have completed their tests on or about July 29, and their report would have arrived in the mail on or around July 31. The day "Zodiac" mailed the first three letters containing the three pieces of the 408. Funny, because, July 31 was too late. Too late, if he wanted to get the 408 on the front pages of the MORNING newspapers of "Fry Aug 1." What was he WAITING for? The results of that ballistics check? It was obviously a positive result. ALL of the negative results were included in VPD's file dump to Nicolai. But not Benson's. Funny. You know? And, uh, yeah, "welcome" to the boards. But--I'm more interested in members who HAVE "homicide reports." Not so much people who are looking for them. |
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Post by Omega on May 25, 2021 8:59:07 GMT -6
Somebody has some GSK files? ? Do you know which police department? This shouldn't come as a surprise to you, Professor, from your days out on the "left coast", but Orange County Sheriff's dept.
See this link:
The late Michelle McNamara was the wife of actor Patton Oswalt. (she passed away unexpectedly in 2016)
The boxes/evidence smuggling episode was so pronounced, that when HBO did their documentary on McNamara and GSK last summer (2020 - titled "I'll Be Gone In The Dark") the scenes at the police department were reenacted and there was almost a sense of pride to pulling off the caper!
I guess wealth and fame does indeed get things done!
BTW, in all that GSK evidence and reports, the name "James DeAngelo" was not found at all.
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Post by Admin Horan on May 25, 2021 11:28:25 GMT -6
I never cared about "serial killers" until I started doing the podcast.
But these "people" don't share those files, right? And these are files only from Orange County Sheriff's Office?
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Post by Omega on May 25, 2021 13:57:25 GMT -6
But these "people" don't share those files, right? And these are files only from Orange County Sheriff's Office? Orange County, correct.
These "people" weren't exactly filling out FOIA requests and getting the information. They supposedly got the boxes of info while the authorities "looked the other way".
They may not share info with common peons, like myself.
But with a "celebrity" like yourself, they may. Just tell them about how The Paisley Park Prince knew your first name back in the day and that you puked with the Circle Jerks behind The Whiskey. That should get the Hollyweird crowd to open up to you!  |
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Post by abraxas82 on May 25, 2021 15:32:54 GMT -6
Could you obtain NYPD files from a FOIA? I went to try and get LAPD documents that way and I do not think you can, you have to request them from the department.
My main interest at the current moment is to find out exactly what Tommy Zaino told detectives on the night of the murder. Because I've had more than one person tell me that what he told police and then later Maury Terry and tabloid TV reporters was vastly different.
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Post by Omega on May 25, 2021 15:56:01 GMT -6
Could you obtain NYPD files from a FOIA? I went to try and get LAPD documents that way and I do not think you can, you have to request them from the department. My main interest at the current moment is to find out exactly what Tommy Zaino told detectives on the night of the murder. Because I've had more than one person tell me that what he told police and then later Maury Terry and tabloid TV reporters was vastly different. NYPD requests go through FOIL (Freedom Of Information Law) via NYC.gov (just type in "NYPD FOIL" in Google and it'll get you there)
It seems over the last couple of years, somebody has been filing various Son of Sam requests through FOIL. Don't know what success they've had because results seem vague on the site.
I don't know about Tommy Zaino. Seems to be a character. Interesting, that Tommy Z. hasn't popped up in any of these latest Son of Sam items, especially the Netflix series or the 2017 anniversary specials. You would figure he would have appeared somewhere.
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Post by abraxas82 on May 25, 2021 17:11:19 GMT -6
I've heard that Zaino described a man casually walk up to the car, shoot inside and then walked away at a slightly faster pace and the person he described fit Berkowitz. His story changed later. Tabloid TV used to pay people for their time. I don't think they really pay anyone these days.
The real reason it's hard to obtain documents is really just sheer laziness on the part of people handling them.
The Yonkers documents from when they briefly re-opened the case would be of interest too. Despite the false information spread around, the case is not still opened. I recently saw a few personal friends of Maury Terry claiming they came to the conclusion Berkowitz wasn't acting alone , but the opposite is true. Why they lie I have no idea.
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Post by Admin Horan on May 25, 2021 18:01:10 GMT -6
Nooooooooooooooooo...the reason it's hard to get police files is, they are NOT public. Trial transcripts are public, because trials are public. (There are exceptions.) Whoever has the Orange County "GSK" files could get in big trouble if they publish them in any form.
You can't just ask for PD or coroner files and get them. It doesn't work that way. Should the undersheriff of Orange County be in trouble for leaking those files? Yeah. Will he be? No. That's politics. But it's got nothing to with "freedom of information."
IF a case is procedurally declared "cold," then the victim's next of kin or executor of their estate can ASK for the files in order to hire private investigators. If, if, if.
And if you "don't think tabloids pay for stories any more" you don't need to be taking up space on this website.
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Post by bustedflush on May 26, 2021 7:45:28 GMT -6
Nooooooooooooooooo...the reason it's hard to get police files is, they are NOT public. Trial transcripts are public, because trials are public. (There are exceptions.) Whoever has the Orange County "GSK" files could get in big trouble if they publish them in any form. You can't just ask for PD or coroner files and get them. It doesn't work that way. Should the undersheriff of Orange County be in trouble for leaking those files? Yeah. Will he be? No. That's politics. But it's got nothing to with "freedom of information." IF a case is procedurally declared "cold," then the victim's next of kin or executor of their estate can ASK for the files in order to hire private investigators. If, if, if. And if you "don't think tabloids pay for stories any more" you don't need to be taking up space on this website. So if "cold" they are fair game for victim families. If "solved" in the case of SOS, you still can't get them? Amazing. This site is so educational. |
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Post by Admin Horan on May 26, 2021 10:00:59 GMT -6
No, they're not even fair game. The release of the files has to be justified on the grounds that outside help with the investigation will result. (And such a release does not authorize publication.) That's the only legal justification. If a case is closed, then there is no legal justification to demand release of the files at all.
In real life, it's up to the DA to decide whether to prosecute anyone who DOES release files on old cases. It was more or less "legal" for Bugliosi to take files home. It would not have been legal for him to publish them. If it's a recent, open case, you can bet your ass you will be prosecuted. And should be.
It was NOT easy for Rodelli to get the FBI to release their copies of the local PD files on "Zodiac." It took a couple of years and 100 thousand dollars in legal fees. It was a landmark case. Did he bother actually READING them? Apparently, not. Like everyone else, he had been fooled by Graysmith's "book," and when he finally got the files, they were a terrible let down--because they didn't confirm his "theory" about the Stine murder. He tried to beat that drum, but he had nothing to beat it with.
I was (and am) the first researcher to ever actually READ all--ALL--the files. Nobody had even bothered to sort them, collate them, arrange them in chronological order, ANYTHING. Let alone actually READ them.
And real police reports are BORING. It's NOTHING but "Witness states she arrived home between 8:30pm and 9:30pm. She fixed herself a drink and went to bed about an hour later. Witness states her alarm clock woke her up at 7:30am the next morning. Witness states she didn't hear any unusual noises in the night." That's it.
But "people" jump to all kinds of crazy conclusions about "coverups!" and other nonsense, because they don't know how boring police reports are SUPPOSED to be. Then, they spot some discrepancy between a police report and a "news" paper article about how the same witness supposedly said she heard a scream in the night. They don't realize that news outlets can get into trouble reporting ACTUAL information from ACTUAL police reports. So, they LIE. Witnesses LIE to reporters, to get their name in the paper. "I didn't hear anything" doesn't get your name in the paper. "I heard a scream around 2:30am." THAT gets your name in their paper. Does the reporter ever ask, "Did you call the police when you heard this alleged scream?" Because that doesn't sell newspapers.
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? Do you know which police department?
