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Post by Omega on Apr 9, 2021 15:59:32 GMT -6
Well, it looks like we're getting closer!
Here is the trailer to the 4-part Netflix documentary series "The Sons of Sam: A Descent Into Darkness"
This is the long awaited series, directed by Josh Zeman and starting on Neflix on May 5th:
Trailer:
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ace
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Post by ace on Apr 12, 2021 8:04:08 GMT -6
A few things from the trailer:
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ace
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Post by ace on Apr 12, 2021 8:06:09 GMT -6
Really gets the noggin joggin. Just how deep will the dive be?
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Post by mannygrossman on Apr 12, 2021 8:26:29 GMT -6
Seems to be a lot of harmonic convergence happening on the SOS case lately. I started a youtube series of walk and talks on it a few weeks ago, and I had no clue all this new stuff was coming out. I am very eagerly awaiting the documentary.
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Post by Omega on Apr 12, 2021 8:55:22 GMT -6
Ace, thanks for posting those stills from the trailer.
This one (below) caught my eye after watching the trailer a couple of time - the Ron Sisman chart/connections
With all the stuff that Maury tried to throw against the wall to see if it would stick (i.e. Manson, Process, Atlanta Child killings, etc.), the two legit things (outside of the direct SOS cases/breakdowns and the Yonkers/Westchester/Bronx connections) that came out of the "The Ultimate Evil" and most likely connected to the SOS saga are the Arlis Perry and Ron Sisman related stories.
When you look at YouTube and on the net, these two stories generate the most interest today and get the average person interested in the SOS (again, outside of the direct related SOS cases/stories)
The Manson and Process stuff sometimes loses these people when they start reading "The Ultimate Evil"
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ace
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Post by ace on Apr 12, 2021 10:07:05 GMT -6
Ace, thanks for posting those stills from the trailer.
This one (below) caught my eye after watching the trailer a couple of time - the Ron Sisman chart/connections
With all the stuff that Maury tried to throw against the wall to see if it would stick (i.e. Manson, Process, Atlanta Child killings, etc.), the two legit things (outside of the direct SOS cases/breakdowns and the Yonkers/Westchester/Bronx connections) that came out of the "The Ultimate Evil" and most likely connected to the SOS saga are the Arlis Perry and Ron Sisman related stories.
When you look at YouTube and on the net, these two stories generate the most interest today and get the average person interested in the SOS (again, outside of the direct related SOS cases/stories)
The Manson and Process stuff sometimes loses these people when they start reading "The Ultimate Evil"
I couldn't resist grabbing screenshots, lol. More clues! Those relatively localized New York connections, such as Sisman, are fascinating to me. I was just reading some comments under Mr. Grossman's Mr. Real Estate video and this one stood out: Perhaps someone was feeding Terry info that was designed to deliberately throw him off the trail or discredit his research, ie "you were wrong about X so how can I trust Y and Z?" Going back to Arliss, someone allegedly set up a fake phone number to collect intel from her friends and family- if that's true, to rephrase a line from The Big Lebowski, we're not dealing with morons, lol.
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Post by marionumber1 on Apr 12, 2021 11:53:50 GMT -6
Wouldn't surprise me if one of those people was Ted Gunderson, the "ex"-FBI agent who appeared to be guiding Maury Terry when it came to the Southern California investigation (which I and many others consider the weakest part of his book). The SoCal section of The Ultimate Evil is full of anonymous sources with no inherent reason for their trustworthiness, and they are the provenance of some of the more dubious claims like Bill Mentzer as Manson II. I have a feeling that Gunderson, who was basically Maury's intro into that world, made a lot of those connections for him.
Gunderson's motives are hard to discern but I've always been skeptical, especially given his high placement in the FBI to the point of heading the Memphis, Dallas, and Los Angeles field offices during the 70s. I doubt anyone can manage manage to ascend that far without being someone who is willing to suppress dissent and look the other way at covert operations; especially in those three cities, all covert ops hotbeds, where he was the SAC. He seems to have a way of surfacing in nearly every prominent conspiracy case (Jeffrey MacDonald, McMartin preschool, Maury's investigation, the Franklin scandal, Danny Casolaro, etc.) and muddying the waters.
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ace
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Post by ace on Apr 12, 2021 12:40:04 GMT -6
Wouldn't surprise me if one of those people was Ted Gunderson, the "ex"-FBI agent who appeared to be guiding Maury Terry when it came to the Southern California investigation (which I and many others consider the weakest part of his book). The SoCal section of The Ultimate Evil is full of anonymous sources with no inherent reason for their trustworthiness, and they are the provenance of some of the more dubious claims like Bill Mentzer as Manson II. I have a feeling that Gunderson, who was basically Maury's intro into that world, made a lot of those connections for him. Gunderson's motives are hard to discern but I've always been skeptical, especially given his high placement in the FBI to the point of heading the Memphis, Dallas, and Los Angeles field offices during the 70s. I doubt anyone can manage manage to ascend that far without being someone who is willing to suppress dissent and look the other way at covert operations; especially in those three cities, all covert ops hotbeds, where he was the SAC. He seems to have a way of surfacing in nearly every prominent conspiracy case (Jeffrey MacDonald, McMartin preschool, Maury's investigation, the Franklin scandal, Danny Casolaro, etc.) and muddying the waters. Yeah, he did have a knack, didn't he. If you need someone to perform a misdirection op, who better to call on than an "expert"?
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Jon
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Post by Jon on Apr 12, 2021 13:39:05 GMT -6
Fascinating screenshots indeed! Thanks, Ace. Looking forward to the show. (And thanks again for all the videos, Manny! I've really been enjoying them.) Recently I came into possession of some interesting photos and information, which I (and others) are still trying to fit into the bigger picture.
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Post by marionumber1 on Apr 12, 2021 13:42:19 GMT -6
There hasn't been a whole lot of scrutiny about Gunderson's background, but I can't help but wonder if he was prepped for a role like this going back a while. He was a 1950 graduate of the University of Nebraska-Lincoln, which has the appearance of being a spook school. The University of Nebraska system's president from 1977 to 1989 was Ronald Roskens, under whom the university system partnered with USAID to send anti-Soviet/pro-jihad textbooks to Afghanistan as part of US intelligence support of Islamist groups. Roskens went on to be appointed by George H.W. Bush as head of USAID, after his 1989 firing that was purportedly due to him having been reported to the regents board as a pedophile. A couple years later, the University of Nebraska-Lincoln got a chancellor Graham Spanier, who served there from 1991 to 1995 and then went on to become president at Penn State where he covered for Jerry Sandusky's crimes. As for other UNL alums at the same time as Gunderson, here is an interesting one ( Lincoln Journal Star, "Weaver, former Lincoln businessman, dies", 2013/03/27): Note that the Nebraska Aeronautics Commission, which Weaver headed under the 1967-71 tenure of Gov. Norbert Tiemann, was previously headed by John Ramsey's father (1947-56) who later headed the Michigan Aeronautics Commission (1957-79). Weaver would have graduated high school around 1945 or 1946, so he was almost certainly attending at the same time as Gunderson. And as luck would have it, the Franklin scandal would later (re?)unite the two, because Weaver ran a conservative group investigating the Franklin case and Gunderson was brought on as an investigator ( Lincoln Journal Star, "Ex-FBI agent hired in child-abuse probe", 1991/06/03): I don't know of any public mention of the possibility that the two already knew each other previously, but the coincidence is uncanny.
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ace
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Post by ace on Apr 12, 2021 13:54:09 GMT -6
Fascinating screenshots indeed! Thanks, Ace. Looking forward to the show. (And thanks again for all the videos, Manny! I've really been enjoying them.) Recently I came into possession of some interesting photos and information, which I (and others) are still trying to fit into the bigger picture. Several older, distinguished-looking gentlemen in the collage. I wonder what Netflix meant by this, for example:
Attachments:
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Jon
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Post by Jon on Apr 12, 2021 14:03:18 GMT -6
Fascinating screenshots indeed! Thanks, Ace. Looking forward to the show. (And thanks again for all the videos, Manny! I've really been enjoying them.) Recently I came into possession of some interesting photos and information, which I (and others) are still trying to fit into the bigger picture. Several older, distinguished-looking gentlemen in the collage. I wonder what Netflix meant by this, for example:
I wish I knew. At the very least, I think we can safely say that a lot of people in high places were involved with the cult to one extent or another.
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Post by Omega on Apr 12, 2021 14:13:59 GMT -6
I'm getting a feeling that us SOS "junkies" are going to be dissecting this Netflix documentary frame by frame like the Zapruder film!
There was the Warren Commission. Might as well have the "Horan Commission"!
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Post by mannygrossman on Apr 13, 2021 9:05:42 GMT -6
I'm looking forward to the documentaries. I really wonder what take they will go with. Seems to be mainly focused on Maury Terry as a personality, but we'll see. I didn't know this documentary was in the works when I started producing my Youtube series of walk and talks on the SOS cult, but I'm glad I know now. There seems to be a zeitgeist bringing us all together at this moment in time. I wonder if there is a reason why......
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ace
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Post by ace on Apr 13, 2021 14:45:38 GMT -6
Seems to be mainly focused on Maury Terry as a personality, but we'll see. I sure hope not. Maury Terry, as a person with flaws or whatever, is the least interesting aspect of the SOS story, by my reckoning. I'm starting to see more and more moaning about Terry and it's pointless.
Maybe he got some bad info, maybe he was steered in strange directions, but that has no bearing on the SOS case itself, from motives to perpetrators.
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