jack
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Post by jack on Nov 10, 2020 13:13:29 GMT -6
From Jack Johnson: This 2020 obituary for James Herbert Gibbons. This man and his wife were members of the O.T.O or Solar Lodge that was alleged to be connected with Manson. They were arrested with other members of the satanic cult in 1969 for satanic ritual abuse of their 6 year old son (this son is not mentioned in the obit) . The son was taken by authorities.
www.legacy.com/obituaries/pressdemocrat/obituary.aspx?n=james-herbert-gibbons&pid=195543246Here you go from the Seventh Day Adventist (James Gibbons was a Seventh Day Adventist according to his obituary) archive you find Eleanor Dossenko and a Dr. Bernard Briggs. Dr. Brian E Briggs teamed up with Barry Dossenko putting on these organic, wholistic BS conferences under their front company F.U.T.U.R.E Inc. www.newspapers.com/clip/23648384/serena-dossenko/And here is likely the son of John Koskan the South Dakota organic farmer with Barry and Serena Dossenko's F.U.T.R.E. conferences. He is running for political office rapidcityjournal.com/news/john-koskan-district-26/article_2815b3a1-208c-58ea-8190-ba442c5fe98e.htmlDr. Briggs obituary-- one of his grandchildren is also named Brian. www.minotdailynews.com/obituaries/2013/01/dr-brian-briggs/In 2013 a younger Brian Briggs would be arrested and charged in a drug distribution ring. His partner and ring leader Noah Bergland is the grandson of former Secretary of Agriculture Robert Bergland who served under wacko Jimmy Carter ( knew John Wayne Gacy and Jim Jones). And speaking of Briggs, this Noah Bergland and others in his criminal drug ring also worked at American Crystal Sugar in Grand Forks ND. Back in 1966 the President and CEO was Charles Briggs. documents.adventistarchives.org/Periodicals/NUO/NUO19781218-V42-26.pdf1978-12-18 Northern Union Conference of Seventh-day Adventists, Northern Union Conference of David and Julie Blume, greeted the children of the Minot Seventh-day Adventist Church recently, as they returned to the recreation room after their annual trek into the eerie Hallowe'en night with requests for "canned goods for the needy". Under the supervision of Home and School Leaders, Irvin Clever and Eleanor Dossenko, along with Pathfinder leaders, David and Julie Blume |
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jack
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Post by jack on Nov 10, 2020 12:50:23 GMT -6
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Post by mysteriouscourtier on Nov 10, 2020 10:59:13 GMT -6
Mario- thank you for that.
I haven't had a chance to read Max Call's book. The fact of his association with Chaplin Ray Hoekstra and his International Prison Ministry is also troubling.
Not that there's anything wrong with prison outreach ministry, per se. There's something admirable about people like Sister Clemmie and her work. I don't share her compassion for rapists and murderers, I couldn't do what she did, frankly.
But the fact that Max Call's book is ultimately an evangelical redemption testimonial. That genre is not investigative journalism and shouldn't be mistaken for it. "Inspirational testimonials" are ultimately less concerned with accuracy, facts, and truth than with "narratives that glorify God" and "bring people to Christ".
I've always been skeptical of Toole & Lucas as "a homosexual couple", or Lucas as a bisexual and Toole as his Gay lover, also. Not impossible, but they might have been portrayed that way to make them a better fit with Gayland Hurst's perverted theories about "satanic" perverts. Hurst was an influential figure with The Rangers and Texas prison authorities at that time.
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Post by Admin Horan on Nov 10, 2020 9:20:09 GMT -6
I call it gobbledegook because it's completely worthless as information, or wisdom, or anything else. Let alone "magick power." 99 percent of it isn't even "traditional" material. It's all been fabricated in the last 150 years. Hawthorne took the actual book "The Chemical Marriage of Christian Rosycross" and turned it into a novel. An excellent novel, even if you don't know anything about alchemy and other related hermetic texts from history. Freemasonry is at least built on actual ancient "secret teachings." But "Theosophy" and Crowley's gobbledegook is just made up bullshit. So is Gardner's "Wicca." They claim ancient sources, but they basically just made it up.
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Post by Admin Horan on Nov 10, 2020 9:03:35 GMT -6
Speaking of segues, I noticed something about David Letterman that no one has ever mentioned: the way he treated his staff. Carson (and DeCordova) often treated the staff of the Tonight Show like shit. The best example I can think of is his "farewell" episode, a little short behind-the-scenes film that was, according to Johnny's introduction, supposed to be about the STAFF. But when you watch it, it's about JOHNNY. Period.
Dave made his staff stars of his show. It's not just "cute" the way he let them pop up on the show for a few seconds of dialogue or a little skit or whatever. Under union contracts, they got PAID extra money to come out during the monologue and bash their boss, or whatever. When the Writers Guild went out on strike, Letterman, who got his start in the business as a writer, did not cross their picket line until he settled with them separately. NO ONE else on TV did that. No one.
Now, back to the topic at hand: watch old episodes, and cringe while Johnny and his guests joke and joke and joke about being pedophiles.
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jack
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Post by jack on Nov 10, 2020 5:36:43 GMT -6
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jack
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Post by jack on Nov 10, 2020 5:21:53 GMT -6
It's amazing we cant get a answer to all these connections. One of the OJ Simpson key talking heads Greta Van Sustren (sp?) her husband also a lawyer by trade worked with JFK suspect Gordon Novell in the Waco case during the 1990's. In the early 1980's Novell worked with porno king Larry Flynt who employed Bill Mentzer and he killed Roy Radin in what became known as Cotton Club Murders. Bob Shapiro represented Producer Robert Evans to keep Evans from being prosecuted with the other conspirators. Robert Evans dated Simpson gal pal Paula Barbieri (sp?).
Simpson case was not about race, celebrity or any of the other nonsense. The Bundy killings in 1994 were done by the same Hollyweird interests involved in the Manson murders in 1969 and they had to cover it up. They also used it for mass brainwashing of the population. OJ became guilty in the minds of millions without a scintilla of evidence pointing to him as the killer.
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jack
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Post by jack on Nov 10, 2020 5:12:11 GMT -6
I thought that was the John Lennon shooter Mark Chapman. If it's true Hinkley lived across the street then that makes two assassins.
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jack
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Post by jack on Nov 10, 2020 5:09:35 GMT -6
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Post by elantric on Nov 9, 2020 22:44:46 GMT -6
texashistory.unt.edu/ark:/67531/metapth346672/m1/1/Page from Lee Harvey Oswald's diary basic summary is "Who could instigate a Military Coup in America? - the right wing "US Marine Corp", and Oswalds observation that Southern racists lower USA's standing in the eyes of the world, and international Sports events where negro's often take the gold medal, only to return home to USA as a second class citizen in a white supremacist neighborhood  DescriptionBookmark this section
Evidence photograph of a page in a document removed from Lee Harvey Oswald's house. The page contains handwritten notes.
Physical DescriptionBookmark this section
1 photograph : b&w ; 7 x 5 in.
Creation InformationBookmark this section
Dallas (Tex.). Police Department. November 1963.
ContextBookmark this section
This photograph is part of the collection entitled: John F. Kennedy Memorial Collection and was provided by the Dallas Municipal Archives to The Portal to Texas History, a digital repository hosted by the UNT Libraries. It has been viewed 496 times, with 8 in the last month. More information about this photograph can be viewed below.
texashistory.unt.edu/explore/collections/JFKDP/browse/?q=&t=fulltext&sort=added_d
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Post by kmik on Nov 9, 2020 21:16:08 GMT -6
Wow JR that's awful!!
I certainly believe when Sue came to the living room she came to protect them hence the defensive wounds on her. It's just hard for me to believe anyone went into the house to wait for Johnny and Dana, if that's who they were after, because it would have been much easier to wait and catch them before they went in. And it was obviously dark enough outside for no one to have noticed someone out there.
You know I often go back to what Henry Thompson told his roommate, that it started out as a game, and can see that might be a real possibility - not saying Phillip was in Cabin28 that night (although he and Chuck were in Keddie) but he very well may have heard what happened. I do believe there are people who have heard who committed these murders but they do not tell LE because they either don't want to get involved or they have convinced themselves it's probably just rumor. |
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Post by marionumber1 on Nov 9, 2020 19:35:27 GMT -6
You raise some fair questions, but I don't really think these are too anomalous either. We have to keep in mind the multiple layers through which this information is filtered: practitioners who are at least somewhat invested in the "black mass" idea but far more concerned about using it as a social glue for their contract murder group, uneducated drifters who are likely to remember highlights and not all the finer points of the theology, and FBI interrogators who probably find all of this baffling and are not going to pursue or record every detail of such a lurid topic as satanic ceremonies. "...that he would have to participate in the ceremony and that they were going to take someone's life so that the devil would have more spirits" Here Ottis is describing the purpose of the ceremony in which they are going to murder someone on their altar thing. Yes? And the purpose he states is "the devil would have more spirits". He doesn't mention any other purposes at that point, like it's The Devil's Communion, or it mocks Christian's ceremony of spiritual union with Jesus/God. It could very well be the case that Toole primarily remembered the ceremony itself and had only a superficial understanding of all the underlying reasons, and/or the interviewers were not interested in exploring this issue very deeply. Here as well, I think interviewer disinterest could be a plausible reason of why this wasn't explored further. If you're an FBI interrogator and the sicko you're interviewing tells you how he cut up, cooked, and ate a girl, are you likely to ask him why+for more details or just accept he's a sick bastard and move on to corroboratable evidence that you could actually investigate? I think that's exactly what he meant. Henry Lee Lucas of all people is probably not someone you can expect to be super precise with word choice. This is an interesting point, but I think Henry was fine because he had Ottis, already a longtime satanist in good standing with the cult, to vouch for Henry and tell his superiors about the numerous murders that Henry had committed even before joining the cult. I think that the satanism requirements for the members were not overly strict as long as they partook in the general trappings and carried out their contract hits effectively. The real purpose would be to socialize them into a life of remorseless killing. I believe this was far more of a business than a hard-and-fast religion, even though they would have borrowed many tenets from more "devout" practitioners. Yes, that did stick out to me when I first read it a while ago. And it does raise a fair question of whether other parts were made up, but it seems like he was relying on Henry's recollection and only added this to fill in a specific and critical gap in Henry's memory. He did, after all, admit openly to his fabrication here even though he certainly didn't have to. The stories of Lucas's childhood in the book are likely something that comes from Lucas's own mouth, and would require reader discretion and/or further investigative journalism to tell how much Lucas is embellishing. I do think that Max Call's book is not without certain red flags but it is still a valuable piece of the narrative. The fact that Lucas's narrative of his cult recruitment lines up so closely with the story told by Thomas Creech a decade earlier is incredibly striking to me. Obviously, I did detect a religious right bias in Call's work; including a screed attacking atheism. It is fairly absurd of him to act like the Hand of Death would mainly be a tool of foreign governments when the connections to US intelligence (paramilitary camps in the Everglades and links to the Salvadoran death squads) are clear. And I do wonder about his singling out of Texas attorney general Jim Mattox as a bad guy in this story, when Mattox seems to have a decent record of taking on corporate interests and the fraudulent voting machine industry (at the same time, he was indicted but later acquitted on bribery charges and has run some quite nasty campaigns, so I have to wonder...). While Call isn't someone I believe in wholeheartedly, his book is not, in my view, something you can throw away either. |
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Post by mysteriouscourtier on Nov 9, 2020 18:37:42 GMT -6
Mario - that's a valid point, thank you. The FBI reports are rather brief. Still, when I was comparing FBI report to Max Call's statements, there were a couple of places in the FBI reports were some understanding of the anti-eucharist described by Call would have very naturally occurred in their narratives - but I couldn't see it there. Can I ask you for your opinion?
FBI pdf ending in D2533805, page 124 (top), Ottis is talking. (I will do my best to quote these word for word, but give the page reference so you can read it for yourself and see if I've misunderstood something)
"...that he would have to participate in the ceremony and that they were going to take someone's life so that the devil would have more spirits"
Here Ottis is describing the purpose of the ceremony in which they are going to murder someone on their altar thing. Yes? And the purpose he states is "the devil would have more spirits". He doesn't mention any other purposes at that point, like it's The Devil's Communion, or it mocks Christian's ceremony of spiritual union with Jesus/God.
page 124 (bottom) and page 125 (top) summary; Ottis talks about murder of a girl and her body being cut up and cooked. "...stated that he ate what he thought were BBQ ribs and was told later that they were the girl's ribs". Unless I'm mistaken, he doesn't mention any ritualistic offering-up of the victim's body or blood accompanied by "the body of our Lord Satan", "the blood of our Lord Satan", at that point. This would be where it goes, though, do you agree?
page 129 - Henry talking now. [redact] explained to Lucas that the organization was involved in rituals which were supposed to reincarnate the devil"
What do you think he meant, by that? Hard to tell, but if he meant "resurrect" he'd be almost there. This next bit seems very odd;
page 131; Lucas stated that he killed the man and cut him up after which some of the man's body parts were taken and eaten by people who were there..."
Lucas refused to eat any of the body parts and never has indulged in that kind of activity" WOW! Henry REFUSED to partake of the unholy eucharist? He must not have understood, that was the climactic point of all that went before? And very ballsy, that could be taken as a sign he's a cop, or a Christian ( in that context just as bad). Lucky they didn't execute him. Just for contrast, at that same point in time Crowley's Gnostic Catholic Church organizations in North America had as flat policy - you don't agree to eat the biscuit and drink the juice, you don't get in. Period.
What is your opinion about that other section of Max Call's interview statement that I quoted? Did he really say that he made up an alibi for one of Henry's murders, and put that in his book knowing it was not true? Because, if so, I don't think I'd trust anything else he put in it, unless I could verify it elsewhere. And, it appears that the narratives of Henry's childhood and youth in Max Call's book have been. Is that right?
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hope
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Post by hope on Nov 9, 2020 17:38:21 GMT -6
And to further visualize the location of the swinging bridge in relation to Keddie, here are some posts & photos added by forum member pinkpanther in 2016 (originally posted to another forum). Thanks PP for taking the time to take & share these photos! pinkPanther Jul 18 '16#5 We are standing in the road that goes to the footbridge. This is looking back towards Keddie...  Jul 18 '16#6 Then we turn around and thats the rd that leads to the path that goes to the bridge. Its waaay farther than I remember it. I dont know what abodes were there in 81.  |
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Omega
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Post by Omega on Nov 9, 2020 17:32:40 GMT -6
How often is SOS killer Berkowitz "off site" and not spending his days sitting idle incarceration? Here he is speaking at Senator Al Franken's Beth El Synagogue in St. Louis Park Minnesota. The rationale of the Rabbi is quite startling. www.tcdailyplanet.net/son-sam-appear-beth-el-synagogue/Hi Jack, and welcome to the boards!
I don't know if you are the "Jack Johnson" that the Professor has been quoting in threads here and also mentioned in his podcast(s), but if you are you owe Ye Olde Professor 20% towards his beer tip jar as commission for being your agent!
I've seen that tcdaileyplanet article before and have a hard time believing if it is true.
A couple of things strike me unusual about it:
A) It seems to be the only link on the internet referencing it and that Berkowitz actually made an appearance physically "on site". Neither of the two major Twin Cities newspapers - the Star Tribune or the St. Paul Pioneer Press - has anything on it. I would also think it would have played "BIG" somewhere in the New York media if Berkowitz was actually physically leaving prison for something like this, especially around an "anniversary date".
B) At the bottom of the article, it states the following - "Written on Sept. 16, 2011, but datelined June 11, 2012, these are not actual quotes from Rabbi Davis. For what he did say about the George W. Bush appearance, see the St. Louis Park High School student newspaper, the Echo". That is a huge red flag that the Rabbi didn't say those things. Why print it then? Edit it. It makes reporting the Berkowitz appearance even more suspect.
I can maybe seeing Berkowitz doing some kind of virtual appearance (Skype, Zoom, etc.). Especially, since it seems he is/was involved with a religion "aspect" then (and now)
Still, a little hard to take seriously.
Again, welcome!
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